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Post by LewEngBridewell on Oct 31, 2016 1:21:14 GMT
It's wierd, this circuit has such a long start-finish straight, and yet overtaking is so bloody difficult.
Has there ever been a properly amazing race here?
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Post by Wß on Oct 31, 2016 2:36:38 GMT
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Post by Wß on Oct 31, 2016 2:41:43 GMT
It's wierd, this circuit has such a long start-finish straight, and yet overtaking is so bloody difficult. Has there ever been a properly amazing race here? Going to be even worse next year I fear. Unless the new tires can take a hell of a lot of punishment, close following really removes much of the aero efficiency for the following car, that's why there were so many locked brakes. Interesting tid bit I heard, the fastest ever speed for an F1 car was recorded by Bottas, 231.9 MPH if I recall correctly.
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Post by dogued on Oct 31, 2016 3:32:02 GMT
It's wierd, this circuit has such a long start-finish straight, and yet overtaking is so bloody difficult. Has there ever been a properly amazing race here? Going to be even worse next year I fear. Unless the new tires can take a hell of a lot of punishment, close following really removes much of the aero efficiency for the following car, that's why there were so many locked brakes. Interesting tid bit I heard, the fastest ever speed for an F1 car was recorded by Bottas, 231.9 MPH if I recall correctly. Overtaking is difficult because the cars are so damn wide compared to the track width... and they want to make them WIDER.
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Post by Hammer on Oct 31, 2016 5:24:10 GMT
So..I narrowed down the single factor which will influence the 2016 WDC. It's not about the drivers, not about the tracks coming, it comes down to weather in Brazil.
If it rains in Brazil during the race, Lewis is WDC this season. If it doesn't, Nico is WDC this season.
Why? Well Nico sucks in the rain. I'd expect Lewis to win, Nico to come 4th or lower. That's a difference of 13 points. And Lewis to win Abu Dhabi and win the WDC by 1 point.
But of course we need that rain to intervene during race day. Abu Dhabi will be dry 110%.
Anyone going to Brazil and know the rain dance here?
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Post by Liam Catterson on Oct 31, 2016 7:13:34 GMT
Vettel get 10 sec time penalty for moving under braking on Ricciardo finishing order is now, 3rd Ricciardo, 4th Verstappen, 5th Vettel. This now screws up my pool results. So now Charlie can fuck off???
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Post by racechick on Oct 31, 2016 8:05:08 GMT
Okay, my take on this.
Emotional response. HAHA! Serves crybaby right!
Reasoned response.
The most exciting part of that GPwas when the two Red Bulls and Vettel were fighting together. And we have two penalties from it. What does this tell drivers? What message does it give? It's over regulated. This over regulation also allows the canny/ political/ vocal drivers to have a bearing on stewards decisions. Like Slonso and Vettel, shouting over the radio trying to influence decisions.
hamiltobpn did the same as Max at the start if that race, Neither gained a place but maybe helped themselves stat ahead. One gets a penalty and the other doesn't, Why......
1. Because it was the start of the race and stewards are lenient.? Not a good enough reason, open to interpretation. They sometime do give out penalties at the start.
2. They didn't want to interfere in the championship? Not a good enough reason. The rules are for everyone and everyone is taking part in the championship in every single race,
3. They wanted to teach Max a lesson? Not a good enough reason. That's an emotive response to the incident by the stewards and not an objective one,
The F1 rules are an over complicated mess.
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Post by Frontrunner on Oct 31, 2016 8:11:02 GMT
Lesson learnt today, don't tell Charlie to fuck off.
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Post by Hammer on Oct 31, 2016 8:20:17 GMT
I like Vettel a lot more than I do Charlie.
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Post by Liam Catterson on Oct 31, 2016 8:57:55 GMT
1. Because it was the start of the race and stewards are lenient.? Not a good enough reason, open to interpretation. They sometime do give out penalties at the start. 2. They didn't want to interfere in the championship? Not a good enough reason. The rules are for everyone and everyone is taking part in the championship in every single race, 3. They wanted to teach Max a lesson? Not a good enough reason. That's an emotive response to the incident by the stewards and not an objective one, The F1 rules are an over complicated mess. The problem is you say the rules are for everyone and the 'do not give out penalties for lap 1 incidents' ruling is total B.S considering that it's still part of the number of laps in a race, like every driver should be punishable if they are in the series. But then again, consistency and the FIA do not mesh well.
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Post by dogued on Oct 31, 2016 9:56:12 GMT
Lewis vs Fresh Air (lap 1) - not under threat from 2nd place and considering the distance traveled/speed etc it would have been deemed "not gaining an advantage". The fact that Nico held up the train by doing the same and cutting back in front of Max is what made the gap look so much bigger.
Nico vs Max (lap 1) - more to the point... under threat from behind, Nico missed the chicane and gained an advantage by coming out in front of Max where the 2 were side by side into turn 1. Honestly thought he'd get a 5s or told to give the position back.
Nico vs Max (late race) - A real shame. Max should have waited another lap or so, set him up perfectly and taken it.
Max vs Seb (late race) - Fair call, 5s penalty is standard for holding a position or gaining an advantage by missing a chicane. Also a fair call from Max on Seb's use of expletives. For all his smiles last year, I think we're seeing the "Ferrari Effect" that had Alonso so snippy in the last 2 years there. Frustration at the team combined with pressure to deliver... Seb is finding out why Ferrari is a hard team to drive for.
Seb vs Daniel (late race) - Tough call, but it was written in black and white the week before "cannot change direction under braking". Seb wanted that rule to stop Max's moves and it's come back to bite him on the bum! Great driving by the 2 of them to not cause damage.
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1lemon
Junior Member
Posts: 50
Likes: 17
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Post by 1lemon on Oct 31, 2016 11:58:33 GMT
God damn it stewards, either give both Max and Lewis a penalty or neither (Ideally neither). Honestly Charlie.
Although F1 is still my favourite soap opera.
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1lemon
Junior Member
Posts: 50
Likes: 17
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Post by 1lemon on Oct 31, 2016 12:02:49 GMT
The most exciting part of that GPwas when the two Red Bulls and Vettel were fighting together. And we have two penalties from it. What does this tell drivers? What message does it give? It's over regulated. This over regulation also allows the canny/ political/ vocal drivers to have a bearing on stewards decisions. Like Slonso and Vettel, shouting over the radio trying to influence decisions. The vocal thing has and will always exist as teams and drivers try their best to gain any advantage. But I'm totally 100% with you on the penalties, there needs to be standards but you can't kick them down for just racing! There are SO many incidents this year where a the stewards should just not get involved.
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Post by Wß on Oct 31, 2016 12:06:36 GMT
Despite it all, it's been a good year.
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Post by Wß on Oct 31, 2016 16:10:46 GMT
According to Arrivabene Kimi's pass on Hulkenberg was "class, pure class". I think it's statement that summarizes everything that's wrong over at the Scuderia.
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Post by Wß on Oct 31, 2016 18:28:35 GMT
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Post by RyRy on Nov 2, 2016 1:35:20 GMT
Hamilton:- Lap: 1
- Rhythm: Low
- Brakes: Not up to temperature
- Tyres: Not up to temperature
- Fuel: High
- Fight: No - No cars along side/overtaking
- Contact: No
- Time Gained: 0.0~ - Timing clearly shows he backed off, it was followed up with a safety car which made 100% sure that this was the case)
- FIA Penalty: None.
- Own Penalty: Majorly flat spotted tyres on lap 1, he had to run with the damage until lap 17.
Conclusion: It was a lap 1 incident where the car was definitely not up to temperatures plus he was on high fuel, He suffered because of the mistake, he gained no time because of the mistake, no one was challenging him before the mistake & no one would have challenged him if he hadn't made the mistake as the two cars behind were fighting. Rosberg:- Lap: 1
- Rhythm: Low
- Brakes: Not up to temperature
- Tyres: Not up to temperature
- Fuel: High
- Fight: Yes - Car along side.
- Contact: Yes - Car beside hit him off the track. If there was no contact and room was left then Rosberg would of had the inside line for the next corner.
- Time Gained: 0.5~ - Same amount as what it would have been if Rosberg wasn't hit off the track.
- FIA Penalty: None.
- Own Penalty: None.
Conclusion: It was a lap 1 incident where the car was definitely not up to temperatures plus he was on high fuel, He was hit off the track and made no time up. Verstappen:- Lap: 68
[li]Rhythm: High - Brakes: Up to temperature
- Tyres: Up to temperature
- Fuel: Low
- Fight: Yes - Faster car coming pulling out to cut back in.
- Contact: No
- Time Gained: 0.2~ - He also held his position as the Ferrari would have passed him eventually.
- FIA Penalty: 5 Seconds
- Own Penalty: Minor flat spot.
Conclusion: It was lap 68, he was in the rhythm, car was up to temperature and on low fuel, he wasn't pushed off the track, the car behind him was faster at this point of the race, the car behind had made a move where he would have cut back to the outside to get a better run out of turn 3 and challenged again and more than likely been overtaken.
If Hamilton had stayed on track in turn 1 no driver would have been able to overtake him anyway so there was no advantage gained, as the two drivers who had a "chance" were fighting and had a collision which slowed them down, we saw later on in the race with two midfield teams where a near identical scenario happened except the leading car made the corner but even with him making the corner he still wasn't overtaken. Hamilton instantly lifted off as shown in the live timing and as such the gained time was given back, it was then topped off with some assurance for everyone with a safety car which made certain that he hadn't received any time benefit. With the flat spotted tyres he would have lost at least 2 tenths per lap (would more than likely have been higher) which is 3.4~ worth of loss over 17 laps. If he did receive a 5 second time penalty for the first corner incident then he would have still came out in 1st place because when he pitted on lap 17 he was 5.7 seconds ahead of Rosberg but when Rosberg pitted on lap 22 Hamilton ended up 6 seconds ahead of Rosberg so a 5 second time penalty would have meant jack shit. If the lockup from Hamilton was on purpose he wouldn't have locked up to the extent he did, that was a pretty big lockup especially bad for the start of a stint and even worse with a long straight like mexico has. Verstappens lockup when defending against Vettel was half of what Hamilton had suffered.
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Post by racechick on Nov 2, 2016 10:56:16 GMT
Good analysis RyRY.
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Post by Wß on Nov 2, 2016 11:33:35 GMT
What if it had been Hamilton that had yelled a mighty and loud *FU* to Charlie?
A few races ago the F1 world turned upside down when Hamilton made his higher power comment after his engine had blown up.
Vettel sees no reprimand for his radio outburst after the Mexican GP. There's not even a ripple, it's the opposite actually, he's apologized, he wrote an open letter, he stressed whatever.
Honestly the hypocrisy of some fans in this sport knows no bounds.
Good thing this wasn't Hamilton... Calls for him being banned would have rung throughout the interwebz.
Thankfully Vettel has good aryan background, is not a thug/rapper/celebrity, doesn't wear gold chains or have tats and isn't broody when his engine blows up laps away from victory.
So all is well in the h8rsphere, carry on nothing to see here.
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Post by racechick on Nov 2, 2016 19:07:53 GMT
Oh my god! If Hamilton had told Charlie to Fuck Off he'd be banned forever. Racist hypocrisy knows no bounds! He was castigated just for referencing the comedian Sacha Baron Cohen. This shit is really getting to me now.
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