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Post by CookinFlat6 on Mar 30, 2015 1:07:31 GMT
The gap at the end of the race between Lewis and Seb was about the same as that lost by pitting under the SC.
The bottom line is Merc were cocky and figured they could pit and use their superior pace to make up teh ground even if Seb didnt pit or it didnt work out. That was wrong bcause suddenly Ferrari were almost on par with pace. Also Merc wanted to race on the primes, gin figuring their pace would make up for any mis calculation. Well it didnt, the options on the Ferrari were uicker than the primes on the Merc and even lasted longer, and even more damning the options were quicker on the Merc in race conditions than the prime and lasted just as long, so a perfect storm of mercs Mclaren 2012 style lack of common sense, arrogance and poor leadership - this is entirely down to Paddy, its nothing to o with Toto or Niki
Paddy was too textbook and assuming there were no political reasons - failed on his first real test since taking over from Ross,the pace has covered sloppyness so far, Ross would not have gotten screwed by ferrari like this
For some reason the usual Merc power advantage was just not there - either Merc complied with the Shaghai directive early and Ferrari didnt or they decided to go ultra cautious with cooling an turned power down. Its no big deal at all in the scheme of things, Shanghai is were we find out if its on o thos 2 races Merc likes to gift away each year or if its something more sinister achieved by mr Cumhappy
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Post by Hammer on Mar 30, 2015 3:36:19 GMT
The gap at the end of the race between Lewis and Seb was about the same as that lost by pitting under the SC. The bottom line is Merc were cocky and figured they could pit and use their superior pace to make up teh ground even if Seb didnt pit or it didnt work out. That was wrong bcause suddenly Ferrari were almost on par with pace. Also Merc wanted to race on the primes, gin figuring their pace would make up for any mis calculation. Well it didnt, the options on the Ferrari were uicker than the primes on the Merc and even lasted longer, and even more damning the options were quicker on the Merc in race conditions than the prime and lasted just as long, so a perfect storm of mercs Mclaren 2012 style lack of common sense, arrogance and poor leadership - this is entirely down to Paddy, its nothing to o with Toto or Niki Paddy was too textbook and assuming there were no political reasons - failed on his first real test since taking over from Ross,the pace has covered sloppyness so far, Ross would not have gotten screwed by ferrari like this For some reason the usual Merc power advantage was just not there - either Merc complied with the Shaghai directive early and Ferrari didnt or they decided to go ultra cautious with cooling an turned power down. Its no big deal at all in the scheme of things, Shanghai is were we find out if its on o thos 2 races Merc likes to gift away each year or if its something more sinister achieved by mr Cumhappy Exactly. Merc underestimated Ferrari (as we all did I believe) and took the safe route thinking Vettel will fry outside or we'd blast past him anyways. But people are missing the fact that Lewis never really got a setup in there. After missing FP1 and most of FP2. Uncharacteristic of him to not put in the laps which count, at least a few which might've made Seb wet his overalls. With cooler conditions in China, Merc more prepared and hopefully Lewis gets to run during practice...we should see Vettel fans go back into hiding after a very short and sweet sunny day for Ferrari.
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Post by Hammer on Mar 30, 2015 4:17:39 GMT
Classy Ferrari. Don't think this was during the race though since there's a car in the garage.
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Post by racechick on Mar 30, 2015 7:34:23 GMT
Are they laughing at Alonso? Or smiling warmly at an old colleague?
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Post by racechick on Mar 30, 2015 7:41:52 GMT
Damn, I just went through all the laptimes between Ferrari & Mercedes. Without the bad pit strategy would have finished anywhere from 11-14 seconds Vettel with Rosberg a further 4 seconds behind Vettel. (Times created with some machine learning code ) You mean Lewis would have won? Vettel second and Rosberg third? Without that first pitstop? That's what Lewis said, he thought they lost it with the first pitstop. So poor strategy was quite a biggy yesterday. I do hope it wasn't the case that Merc were asked to turn down engines for political reasons. That would be dreadful. But back to strategy, I'm not sure they have anyone that is really sharp in this department. I don't know a great deal about the strategists along the Pitlane but my first choice would be ROSS and my second choice would be Smedley.
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Post by LRW on Mar 30, 2015 7:59:23 GMT
Are they laughing at Alonso? Or smiling warmly at an old colleague? Well it looks like Alonso is smiling to me, as well. So they were probably just having a chuckle together - but why let that get in the way of a good picture. Lol
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Post by LRW on Mar 30, 2015 8:02:06 GMT
Damn, I just went through all the laptimes between Ferrari & Mercedes. Without the bad pit strategy would have finished anywhere from 11-14 seconds Vettel with Rosberg a further 4 seconds behind Vettel. (Times created with some machine learning code ) You mean Lewis would have won? Vettel second and Rosberg third? Without that first pitstop? That's what Lewis said, he thought they lost it with the first pitstop. So poor strategy was quite a biggy yesterday. I do hope it wasn't the case that Merc were asked to turn down engines for political reasons. That would be dreadful. But back to strategy, I'm not sure they have anyone that is really sharp in this department. I don't know a great deal about the strategists along the Pitlane but my first choice would be ROSS and my second choice would be Smedley. But isn't Malaysia Petronas' home GP? They wouldn't under power their cars for that - regardless of political pressure.
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Post by racechick on Mar 30, 2015 8:09:57 GMT
I don't think they would do it, and surely they weren't asked to. But this is F1
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Post by Wß on Mar 30, 2015 11:25:03 GMT
They lost the race trying to outsmart Ferrari on a tire strategy that they didn't need try and outsmart, just stay in front. Nothing more, nothing less. The SC extended the first set of medium tires for Seb by another six or seven laps. Running in clean air helps with the degradation, further helping.
It ultimately allowed them to go for a two stopper easily, which gained them 20~22 seconds or so on track. He would have been 10 seconds behind Hamilotn and fighting to keep Nico behind. Merc need to get a better stratergist, it was Paddy's only weakness IMO with McLaren.
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Post by the2ndcoming on Mar 30, 2015 11:51:47 GMT
I think trying to outsmart Ferrari is one thing but from all accounts, they, Mercedes AMG, messed up on setups...as Toto puts it, they went a bit too aggressive and the extreme track temperature ultimately led to premature tyre degradation. There is still the question-mark if Lewis had stayed out and ahead of Seb, if he would be able to cope long enough for his first stint and planned stop. I could envisage Seb having better pace and passing him in the latter stages of that stint. It would still come down to a ding-dong back and forth at the end and I suspect Seb would still prevail. He would be the last of the pair to pit, leaving him with fresher rubber to the end. They would have crossed the line with a smaller gap than we saw but the result would still be the same...IMO. Lesson learned.
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Post by Wß on Mar 30, 2015 12:04:09 GMT
James Allison is keeping his feet on the ground though.
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Post by LRW on Mar 30, 2015 14:08:34 GMT
One thing I really liked about this weekends podium (no, most definitely not EJ - that guy is embarrassing) - From what I could tell - there was no booing for SV or NR.
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Post by Wß on Mar 30, 2015 14:16:40 GMT
Everyone's thirsty for competition. EJ does make me cringe though.
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Post by the2ndcoming on Mar 30, 2015 14:47:11 GMT
One thing I really liked about this weekends podium (no, most definitely not EJ - that guy is embarrassing) - From what I could tell - there was no booing for SV or NR. Did you notice that Lewis got a little bit of a booing? I was surprised by that. The guy has been a model brand for F1, both as a Champion and as a person...not to mention he's at a "home" race for Petronas. Am I missing something? Such funny business.
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Post by RyRy on Mar 30, 2015 14:48:24 GMT
Are they laughing at Alonso? Or smiling warmly at an old colleague? Well it looks like Alonso is smiling to me, as well. So they were probably just having a chuckle together - but why let that get in the way of a good picture. Lol Cross Post from Cock-Up or ConspiracyI would put it down to it being too hot and unable to work with the tires, which is possibly and probably more of a problem because Hamilton missed a session and a half of running which could have given them the tire data they needed. However, they did make a massive cockup with the pitting early which put them on a back foot and they couldn't catch fast enough. Throughout the race the Mercedes drivers did reduce the gap to Vettel which shows they were still faster but not fast enough to make up the deficit because of the heat. By my calculations using a bit of machine learning code I removed the safety car and made it play out as normal and it showed Lewis Hamilton would have been 11-14 seconds ahead of Vettel BUT Rosberg would have been 4 seconds behind Vettel in 3rd so they were faster this weekend but again that could be the heat making him come 3rd plus the traffic Rosberg was stuck behind. I fully expect that in Shanghai Mercedes will once again finish 20 seconds ahead of their nearest rival, it's likely to be significantly cooler by at least 10 degrees.
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Post by Hammer on Mar 30, 2015 14:54:16 GMT
One thing I really liked about this weekends podium (no, most definitely not EJ - that guy is embarrassing) - From what I could tell - there was no booing for SV or NR. Did you notice that Lewis got a little bit of a booing? I was surprised by that. The guy has been a model brand for F1, both as a Champion and as a person...not to mention he's at a "home" race for Petronas. Am I missing something? Such funny business. Bunch of retarded Malaysian fans in a corner somewhere. wait..
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Post by LRW on Mar 30, 2015 15:01:12 GMT
I'll be honest - I didn't hear any booing for any of them?
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Post by Hammer on Mar 30, 2015 15:02:30 GMT
I heard a bit of howling at the end of Lewis' interview which COULD be mistaken for booing, but maybe it was just howling. I'm just calling Msians retards if indeed it was booing.
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ang44
Full Member
Posts: 355
Likes: 175
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Post by ang44 on Mar 30, 2015 15:08:21 GMT
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Post by CookinFlat6 on Mar 30, 2015 15:48:51 GMT
I bet he had wanted to bet on Torro Rosso first
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